Cholesterol numbers and lowering carbs

[Roadstr]

Bellow are my cholesterol numbers and I have offered some commentary on how my diet has changed to include good saturated fats

04/20 TC=229 TRI=145 HDL=76 LDL=129
04/11 TC=187 TRI=58 HDL=63 LDL=109
04/05 TC=209
04/03 TC=222 TRI=71
03/19 Quest Diag TC=210 TRI=100 HDL=62 LDL=128

On 4/3 I started eating oat bran muffins again, low fat dairy and watching saturated fats. This after visiting with my doc who found LDL too high for his liking, but he wasn't too excited about it with my HDL so high.

After 4/11 I dropped my carbs from what had been below 120 grams/day to much lower 40-60 grams/day, stopped low fat dairy and all grains and oat bran. The HDL went up a 13 and LDL went up 20. I'm ok with that because it's more protective. What surprised me was the TRI... really, no honey pots, but... the higher TRI reading could be from wine.

On 4/20 I cut out wine and because I have read how other LC'ers have had cholesterol numbers that I would love to have (like Karole's!) by varying their LC diet, so I lowered my carbohydrates below 20 grams/day. That should drop my TRI level along with no wine!.

I'm eating beef, turkey and eggs from critters that are loose and eat grass and organic. I get a free range chicken every once and a while, but still use Tyson's. Butter and cream are from grass fed. My macro ratios are around 30/4/60 with today as typical 2,000 kCal, 150 g protein, 13 g carbs, 145 g fats (75 g saturated). I don't limit protein or saturated fats, I track to make sure I get enough, not to limit anything except carbs. Yesterday I started 1 T EVCO in a cup of green tea 30 minutes before breakfast and lunch. I have a 50 gram spring mix, 30 g broccoli florets, 30 g tomato, a few greek olive, feta cheese and 7 g olive oil with the evening meal (6 grams carbs).

I will take readings on Sunday 4/26 and see where they go and post them. I now believe saturated fats are beneficial. I'm trying to do something I didn't think could be done, but I see Karole and others have done it with great cholesterol numbers. I really didn't think it was possible to lower LDL's to 100 while eating saturated fats. Goes to show what I know! I know it's not possible for me to do it on a semi-low carb diet, so I'm going to give it my best shot by taking my carbs vary low and good saturated fats.

[Karole]

Hi, want to say that I never have tried to stay below or at 20 ecc per day. When I was losing I kept it at 30 ecc,(just like Dr. Eades wrote in PP) then on maintenance I have stayed around 40 per day.

Also, I did use fish oil, and lechithin last year, plus daily exercise. I have never paid any attention to how much saturated fats I ate and still don't. I try to drink a 5 oz. glass of wine in the evening, but often forget it or life gets in the way.

It took a while for my lipids to respond--many, many months so no one should expect instant results. As I said before, if the cholesterol results should change, it won't worry me , I want to keep the trig. low. I like good ratios. I will never consider taking statins, so sometimes I wonder why I even bother to do the lipid panel each year.-- But I must say that I was happy to find this woe does work --when followed in the way the Drs. Eades laid it out.

[maxlharris]

Broken record here, but since it doesn't seem to be taking, I thought I'd do something graphic this time:

http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e248/maxlharris/Capture4-23-2009-94531AM.jpg
Roadstr, this is your total cholesterol with a +/-10% error bar. At 10%, we could draw a line at about 202 and hit EVERY one of your numbers. At 15% for labs, we have a range from 195 up to about 210. That's assuming a good 12 hour fasting sample. Error goes up quite a bit without fasting.

I made another chart, that might be interesting as well:
http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e248/maxlharris/Confidence.jpg
I put trendlines on your data. While the trendlines look not so good, I made Excel calculate the R-squared (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coefficient_of_determination) value for me. The most robust one is your HDL number, which, based on three data points is still only 57% descriptive, though trending upward.
The other numbers are all moving about quite a bit more. Your Trig number is about 10% descriptive. Your LDL number is about 5% and your total is about 2% descriptive.

I'm not going to suggest that home testing is a waste of your time (I may believe that, but it's your time and you should spend it how you like), but I think your data set points to why doctors don't do lipid panels more often than once every 4-8 weeks... For one, it's a moving target. For two, you are given the opportunity to make yourself nuts with it. For three, it's not cost free (in terms of time or resources) and the opportunity cost (while different for all) is too high for a doctor to run you in every two weeks to test your lipid number.

I'm not saying do not concern yourself with your lipids. But, in the range you are running, you are at the low end of the total mortality curve. You have a high HDL, your trigs are in the range, and really, it's a pretty nice number all around. Your doc might be a lipid phobe, but that doesn't mean you have to be one, too.

[Roadstr]

One phrase comes to mind from the movie "Top Gun" and it went something like this when Tom Cruise was asked how he thought he was doing... "...i don't know, but it's looking good so far!"
I have entered the macro nutrients bellow for the last 6 days. Beyond that I have been making a cup of green tea and putting 15 grams of coconut oil in it before breakfast and lunch along along with taking 300 mg of niacin and cod liver oil.
My weight this morning is 193.0 and on 4/19 it was 195.6. Bellow are the results of cholesterol and triglycerides taken with the CardioChek device. I couldn't believe the first cholesterol number and so I opened up another new cholesterol package of test strips and took it again. Let me say I don't know what my cholesterol numbers are, I only know the trend from using the CardioCheck. The new HDL test strips that I bought read an error, so I couldn't take HDL. Whatever my cholesterol is I am very confident that it's much lower today than a week ago. I have no doubt that my HDL is the same or has improved. My triglycerides are much better today than a week ago.
As I write this I'm listening to a story on Sunday Morning about these fire fighters that stopped eating meat because of high cholesterol. If they only knew... as for me I'm staying the course and will post my results here, in this thread next Sunday.

Gotta get ready for take off!
Have a great Sunday everyone. :D

....................4/25....4/24......4/23.....4/22.....4/21.....4/20
Calories.........1993....2211.....1842.....2003... .1452.....2141
Protein............146.....122.......172.......151 .....132......155
Carbs ...............36......29.........14.........14... .....9........16
Fiber..................6......11...........2...... ....2........3..........4
Fat.................140.....177........122.......1 45......93.......158
Sat.Fat..............70......82..........62....... .74.......50........65
Cholesterol----201............................................... .....229
Cholesterol.....173
Triglyceries......61.............................. .....................145
HDL................NA............................. .......................76

Below are daily averages over the period listed...
===========================================
Nutrition Summary
April 20, 2009 to April 25, 2009
Daily Averages over 6 days
Report generated by XXXX
===========================================

General
===========================================
Energy | 1940.6 kcal
Protein | 146.6 g
Carbs | 19.6 g
Fiber | 4.6 g
Starch | 0.1 g
Sugars | 10.6 g
Fat | 139.2 g
Alcohol | 0.0 g

Lipids
===========================================
Saturated | 67.4 g
Monounsaturated | 35.6 g
Polyunsaturated | 14.2 g
Omega-3 | 3.6 g
Omega-6 | 9.7 g
Trans-Fats | 1.4 g
Cholesterol | 697.6 mg
Phytosterol | 59.1 mg

[maxlharris]

Roadstr,

Looks like you are living the life (Adding oil is consistent with PP, though not in the specific advice in the books... I know a number of people who do Atkins who used to sip some EVOO and moved to EV coconut to adjust your macronutrient balance with a good fat). And the life is doing okay with you.

If I had the home test and I were very concerned about cholesterol, I'd probably test at most, once weekly, and I'd eat an early dinner the night before, like finish by 7, then take the reading the next AM to have a fasting number. If you aren't 12 hour fasted, you are juggling the numbers beyond the 95% accuracy and the 15%+/- error bar.

I am reasonably sure that you're doing the program correctly now, and I am reasonably sure that you will get the results you want while you do it that way.

Keep on keepin on, Roadstr.

[Roadstr]

Hi Max,
As Dr. Eades has said, "I am in full low-carb mode, genesis-ing that neo glucose like crazy, I feel like a million bucks". I played racquet ball yesterday, felt great and won the second set of 3 player cut-throat. To me, racquet ball and tennis are a HITT sport, because it takes your heart up and down.
The last time I played I was doing oat bran along with plant sterols and my knee's hurt like hell, I had to stop playing I injured one so bad. When I played this time the guys were surprised that I played so hard without any knee issues. I can't explain it, but when I took my cholesterol down last year doing those methods I hurt my shoulder pushing the convertible down on the roadster that took 8 months to get better! Never again! I don't know what it is and can't explain it, but man... my joints feel a lot better now! I mean I think cholesterol numbers are within range now as they were before, maybe a little higher with LDL than before and HDL a lot higher, but feeling a lot better... it just took a while for me to get into "genesis-ing that neo glucose"... I like that phrase.

Roadstr,

Looks like you are living the life (Adding oil is consistent with PP, though not in the specific advice in the books... I know a number of people who do Atkins who used to sip some EVOO and moved to EV coconut to adjust your macronutrient balance with a good fat). And the life is doing okay with you.

If I had the home test and I were very concerned about cholesterol, I'd probably test at most, once weekly, and I'd eat an early dinner the night before, like finish by 7, then take the reading the next AM to have a fasting number. If you aren't 12 hour fasted, you are juggling the numbers beyond the 95% accuracy and the 15%+/- error bar.

I am reasonably sure that you're doing the program correctly now, and I am reasonably sure that you will get the results you want while you do it that way.

Keep on keepin on, Roadstr.

[maxlharris]

It's possible that you have some sort of grain allergy that was causing inflammation in your joints. I'm not a doctor, I'm not allergic to grains, so this is only something that pops out with your story.

It's also possible that the EVCO is working as an anti-inflammatory, and allowing your body to work well under the stress of a racket sport.

As with everyone, there is an adjustment period to fat burning for energy. It sounds like you have adjusted.

Things sound like they are working well.

[Roadstr]

Thanks Max, whatever is going on is working well. Never again will I eat oat bran to pull my cholesterol down like that. The number that it did on my joints was really painful, and I'm not saying others should follow, but this is me and my experience. I never want to push a WOE on anyone, it's their choice and their health. I don't think it was a grain allergy, but I can't rule it out. One thing I can tell you is that I believe EVCO is protective to the colon. The Loma Linda Proton Radiation treatment for Prostate cancer includes in their procedure a balloon. The Proton Radiation treatment that I received at Boston Mass. General Hospital didn't include any balloon. The balloon keeps the radiation away from the colon and now, with me there is some bleeding. But, there is none since using EVCO and low carbing. I believe both are protective.
As far as my joints go, I really think it's the protective nature of saturated fats. Don't know, but I don't think it was an allergy because I'm not allergic to anything. Maybe it's the way it was blocking cholesterol... no idea why, but things are working well.

[Roadstr]

I'm waiting for CardioChek to send HDL test strips because the Wal-Mart HDL test srips were a bad batch. When I receive them I will post my cholesterol numbers.
I can say that my waist size is decreasing and the numbers on the Tanita are going south as well.
Best wishes everyone! I think a healthy liver has a lot to do with it.... I mean why do people decrease calories on a low carb diet and still not reduce their weight? Have you had that experience?